Atheist Talking Points

[eyeshaveit]

If someone has never heard of the Bible or Jesus, they can easily be duped into thinking that the contents of the Bible are true, real, and correct, then, sure, they can be fooled. [I am] someone who is familiar with the Bible and has read it, analyzed it, and found it less than credible. So I am not likely to be fooled by specious claims from an ancient book of magical spells. Thus his use of the Bible as a weapon of mass distraction is a colossal failure.

[eyeshaveit]

Atheist's just don't have any gods in them. 

[eyeshaveit]

Let me remind you that it?s immaterial that ?billions? are said to follow the edicts of Christianity.

[bad actor]

Atheist's just don't have any gods in them. 

Cute thread.

Not that it's really a big deal, but why take this one sentence out of my post and isolate it?

Why not deal with the point I'm actually trying to make?

We all have reality tunnels we experience life through.

Atheist's just don't have any gods in them. 


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reality_tunnel

Reality tunnel is a theory that, with a subconscious set of mental filters formed from beliefs and experiences, every individual interprets the same world differently, hence "Truth is in the eye of the beholder". It is similar to the idea of representative realism, and was coined by Timothy Leary (1920?1996). It was further expanded on by Robert Anton Wilson (1932-2007), who wrote about the idea extensively in his 1983 book Prometheus Rising.

The idea does not necessarily imply that there is no objective truth; rather that our access to it is mediated through our senses, experience, conditioning, prior beliefs, and other non-objective factors. The implied individual world each person occupies is said to be their reality tunnel. The term can also apply to groups of people united by beliefs: we can speak of the fundamentalist Christian reality tunnel or the ontological naturalist reality tunnel.

A parallel can be seen in the psychological concept of confirmation bias?the human tendency to notice and assign significance to observations that confirm existing beliefs, while filtering out or rationalizing away observations that do not fit with prior beliefs and expectations. This helps to explain why reality tunnels are usually transparent to their inhabitants. While it seems most people take their beliefs to correspond to the "one true objective reality", Robert Anton Wilson emphasizes that each person's reality tunnel is their own artistic creation, whether they realize it or not. 

[eyeshaveit]

[1] - A lack of belief is not a belief, no matter how often you mindlessly repeat it.

[2] - Atheism has no holy books and requires none.

[3] - Atheism doesn?t teach salvation for one?s ?sins.?

[4] - Atheism is not something you ?believe in,? it is something you either are or aren't. If you don't believe in deities, you are ?not theistic,? meaning you are ?a-theistic.? That's it. There is no other information or narrative contained in ?atheism? to either ?believe in? or ?not believe in.?

[5] - [Atheism] is not like a religion or a philosophy that has a narrative or any set/list of conditions to it. It is a classification referring to any or all people who do not believe in deities... no matter what they *do* believe in. It is not a singular or specific belief system itself.

[bad actor]

  ATHEIST TALKING POINTS   

[TallRed]

So you learned absolutely nothing from my posts. Noted. I will now assume that you, like many believers who are Trump supporters, have an IQ less than room temperature.

[bad actor]

So you learned absolutely nothing from my posts. Noted. I will now assume that you, like many believers who are Trump supporters, have an IQ less than room temperature.

Oh be nice.

You should know very well by now that eyes doesn't want to play ball with you on your terms. You will drive yourself crazy running around in circles and expecting a different outcome. Sometimes you really do have to just agree to disagree. He's not going to be tossing his Bible in the trash anytime soon, and definitely not because of some post on a forum.

Religious beliefs, and many other beliefs rely on compartmentalization. You will find Trump supporters and Christians in the world who have extremely high IQ's. That's just the way human brains work. I can't believe how many brilliant people I've met that are actually Mormons. My mother had a home teacher who was one of the leading neurosurgeons in Las Vegas.

Religious and political leanings aren't always the best indicator of intelligence or really, compassion either. 

[kevin]

Religious and political leanings aren't always the best indicator of intelligence or really, compassion either. 

no. you are correct. the most cold-blooded people i have ever met were atheists, just as an aside.

thorough self-examination among atheists leads to nihilism, absurdism, or theism. personally, my own choice is absurdism, if for the only reason that i like to read camus.

[bad actor]

i like to read camus.

I'll have to look it up. 

[TallRed]

Oh be nice.

I am. You should hear me when I?m outspoken.

You should know very well by now that eyes doesn't want to play ball with you on your terms. You will drive yourself crazy running around in circles and expecting a different outcome. Sometimes you really do have to just agree to disagree. He's not going to be tossing his Bible in the trash anytime soon, and definitely not because of some post on a forum.

Don?t concern yourself with my mental state. Mr Shave It is small potatoes. His one saving grace is that his posts tend to be succinct, in direct contrast to those of Francis. I like throwing reason in his face. Will it make any difference? Who knows? As the saying goes, one won?t lose by reason that which wasn?t gained through reason.

Religious and political leanings aren't always the best indicator of intelligence or really, compassion either. 

Oh, I disagree completely. Anyone who still is a card-carrying Republican is definitely part of the ?I?ve got mine, you?re on your own? crowd until a natural disaster happens. Mountains of conclusions can be drawn from that. Religion is both more personal and more entrenched.

[kevin]

i like to read camus.

I'll have to look it up. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Myth_of_Sisyphus

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rebel_(book)

[eyeshaveit]

Few [Christians] are taught critical thinking skills or even that it?s permitted and encouraged to question received wisdom.

[1] - Theism exists and the world is the poorer for it, in my opinion.

[2] - An atheist behaves as if god doesn?t exist. No beliefs enter into it.

My beliefs are grounded in empirical fact and not fantasy.

[Inertialmass]

He's not going to be tossing his Bible in the trash anytime soon, and definitely not because of some post on a forum...

Dudes and dudettes show up, spit godly passion for awhile, then seem to just disappear. 

That's not surprising.  These static, antique counterfactuals really don't hold up well in the face of ever-evolving social and scientific progress.  What would be surprising is a florid, public admission that everything they've stood for, everything Mommy and Daddy ever taught 'em about Jesus, Muhammad, Moses, Dharma, Buddha, the Tao, was after all just pretty silly if comforting campfire stories. 

Final deconversion happens offline.

[Inertialmass]

...the most cold-blooded people i have ever met were atheists, just as an aside.

I personally don't "train" my Lab by thumping her in the head with a plank, or drown my wife's excess cats, nor advocate napalm and apartheid for my religious foes.   

[GratefulApe]

Why do Atheists have any talking points about God, gods, the spiritual realm, etcetera. Shouldn't they just go on their merry way and forget about what they don't believe exists? Yet they do have hard opinions about what they don't believe in 

A real Atheist must have better and more important issues to address and discuss. Unless it's just an I'm ok you're not ok childish fascination.

[TallRed]

Final deconversion happens offline.

Not necessarily. I can personally attest to four people, maybe five, deconverting before our eyes in another forum. It?s rare, but it does happen.

[TallRed]

...the most cold-blooded people i have ever met were atheists, just as an aside.

I personally don't "train" my Lab by thumping her in the head with a plank, or drown my wife's excess cats, nor advocate napalm and apartheid for my religious foes.   

Sounds like kev?s usual argument by anecdote.

[TallRed]

Why do Atheists have any talking points about God, gods, the spiritual realm, etcetera. Shouldn't they just go on their merry way and forget about what they don't believe exists? Yet they do have hard opinions about what they don't believe in 

A real Atheist must have better and more important issues to address and discuss. Unless it's just an I'm ok you're not ok childish fascination.

If you theists would keep your religion in your church and your heart, I would have no problem with it. But religion gets moved into politics all too often. Then its pernicious effect must be fought.

[Inertialmass]

[bad actor]

He's not going to be tossing his Bible in the trash anytime soon, and definitely not because of some post on a forum...

Dudes and dudettes show up, spit godly passion for awhile, then seem to just disappear. 

That's not surprising.  These static, antique counterfactuals really don't hold up well in the face of ever-evolving social and scientific progress.  What would be surprising is a florid, public admission that everything they've stood for, everything Mommy and Daddy ever taught 'em about Jesus, Muhammad, Moses, Dharma, Buddha, the Tao, was after all just pretty silly if comforting campfire stories. 

Final deconversion happens offline.

I don't know if you remember, but sometime in the last year we actually had a Mormon start posting. I think it was about 3 or 4 posts before he just disappeared. I kinda hit him a little too quick with both barrels I think and he just quit posting. I even sent him a PM trying to soften things a little in hopes that he would stick around, but to no avail.

I wonder sometimes if he ever actually investigated the things that I asked him to, or if he just pretends as if the conversation never took place. It would be heavy if he showed up one day and said that he left the church. That's not likely, but you never know.

[bad actor]

Why do Atheists have any talking points about God, gods, the spiritual realm, etcetera. Shouldn't they just go on their merry way and forget about what they don't believe exists? Yet they do have hard opinions about what they don't believe in 

A real Atheist must have better and more important issues to address and discuss. Unless it's just an I'm ok you're not ok childish fascination.

[bad actor]

Don?t concern yourself with my mental state.

It was a light-hearted post, I could give two s**ts about your personal mental state.

[TallRed]

Don?t concern yourself with my mental state.

It was a light-hearted post, I could give two s**ts about your personal mental state.

Good to know.

[TallRed]

Don?t concern yourself with my mental state.

It was a light-hearted post, I could give two s**ts about your personal mental state.

I almost forgot to ask: which 2 s**ts are you willing to give?

[eyeshaveit]

[Tallred] certainly believes in some sort of universe, and the one [she] believes in certainly doesn't include gods.

The premise is flawed. In its way, it?s a loaded question the same way the classic question ?When did you stop beating your wife?? is.

[Inertialmass]

What's your game with posting this same ol' same ol' s**t simultaneously in a half dozen different threads???

Okay.

When I was in high school the Universe that I was taught about and that I believed in did not include deep sea hydrothermal vents with a food chain running from chemosynthetic microorganisms on up to large, creepy tubeworms.  My universe did not include mitochondria living as endosymbionts each with its own DNA, thus informing that life may be seen metaphysically as one big gigantamundo cooperative survival enterprise even more than it was seen classically as some big ol' competitive game.  My Universe back then did not include politicians, preachers, rabbis and catholic priests as sexual predators.

Tubeworms, cooperative endosymbionts, sexual predators in position of authority inhabited the null set back then.  They did not enter the intellectual landscape.  They just were not a part of my belief set or worldview.  I gave them no thought whatsoever.   

Today those are part of my belief set and my worldview.  That's only because good evidence for them appeared over the intervening years.  Not so for god.

[TallRed]

What's your game with posting this same ol' same ol' s**t simultaneously in a half dozen different threads???

I?m in his head. I?m SO in his head!

[eyeshaveit]

What's your game with posting this same ol' same ol' s**t simultaneously in a half dozen different threads???

I?m in his head. I?m SO in his head!

Don't you have to use pictures to get into the head,
Of someone with an 'IQ that's lower than room temperature' ???

[Mr. Blackwell]

What's your game with posting this same ol' same ol' s**t simultaneously in a half dozen different threads???

I?m in his head. I?m SO in his head!

Don't you have to use pictures to get into the head,
Of someone with an 'IQ that's lower than room temperature' ???

What amazes me is that she seems to take pride in mocking the mentally impaired.

[Mr. Blackwell]

I see that someone didn't like what I pointed out in my previous comment. That's kind of funny. You see because TallRed is the type of liberal that rails against things like bullying. Bullying is bad. Making fun of or teasing those who are less fortunate is bad. Yet, she describes anyone who believes in the Christian God and votes conservative as being, for lack of a better word, retarded. Mentally challenged. Less able. But, she makes fun of those people. She mocks and teases those people.

I can only conclude that she either doesn't believe that religious conservatives are low IQ or....she firmly believes that it is not only her right but her duty to mock people with low IQ.

[kevin]

lol

[eyeshaveit]

[1] - I have spoken to a number of atheists, agnostics, and humanists over the years since my deconversion. A majority of them cited a close reading of the Bible as one of the chief factors which led to them losing their faith. Many atheists are better acquainted with the contents of the Bible than their believing colleagues.

[2] - A cafeteria Christian [is] able to freely choose which passages to read and which to ignore because of their repellent quality.

[eyeshaveit]

It seems to me that YHWH and Jesus? father are different deities.

[eyeshaveit]

I find it hilarious how christians can move from one extreme (Killer God) to the other (Loving Merciful Jesus) and say they're the same thing.

[eyeshaveit]

When a child is raised in a violent environment, with abusive parents and grows up to be similarly violent and abusive, you don't blame Satan. You blame the parents who conditioned the person to be that way.

[eyeshaveit]

Given how the Hebrew storm god YHWH is depicted in the OT, it?s just good thinking to be afraid of it. One thing I don?t understand is why anyone would want to worship such a pathological, narcissistic monster. Another thing is why anyone would worship this entity when there?s not an iota of empirical evidence to support its existence

[eyeshaveit]

What's funny is people FEAR god. But not the so called source of evil, Satan.
In any other story where there is a villain, the characters or readers fear the villain. But not this book.

[eyeshaveit]

If you want to call the beautiful things in the world evidence for "god" then you gotta explain the not so beautiful too.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_genetic_disorders

These are the horrible things that people are born with with through no fault of their own. The beauty and the ugliness make sense in an "uncaring" universe.

[eyeshaveit]

Today is National Freethought Day:

"October 12 annually celebrates National Freethought Day. This day occurs on the anniversary of the effective end of the Salem Witch trials on October 12, 1692....the hope is to show the public that atheists are just like everyone else" - Wikipedia.

[Boots]

It looks to me like eyes is fishing for applauds, the way he's posting interesting thoughts here.

[eyeshaveit]

Freedom From Religion Foundation Afraid of Noah's Ark - Warns Field Trips Unconstitutional

"Public schools cannot organize trips for students to either the Creation Museum or the Ark Park. It is unacceptable to expose a captive audience of impressionable students to the overtly religious atmosphere of Ham's Christian theme parks...."

https://ffrf.org/images/KYArkParkLetter2018FINAL.pdf


Ken Ham Responds With Offer of Free Admission:

"The atheist groups like American Atheists and the Freedom From Religion Foundation have been increasingly aggressive to restrict the free exercise of religion -- particularly Christianity -- and they've tried to brainwash people with an interpretation of the First Amendment...it does not mean that Christians are second class citizens."

"I would like to see some public schools and public parks to stand up to them and not succumb to their bullying and intimidation. Because the FFRF has sent letters to 1,000 school districts, I'm offering them free admission for the teachers, students who come on an official public school trip."

[TallRed]

Freedom From Religion Foundation Afraid of Noah's Ark - Warns Field Trips Unconstitutional

"Public schools cannot organize trips for students to either the Creation Museum or the Ark Park. It is unacceptable to expose a captive audience of impressionable students to the overtly religious atmosphere of Ham's Christian theme parks...."

https://ffrf.org/images/KYArkParkLetter2018FINAL.pdf


Ken Ham Responds With Offer of Free Admission:

"The atheist groups like American Atheists and the Freedom From Religion Foundation have been increasingly aggressive to restrict the free exercise of religion -- particularly Christianity -- and they've tried to brainwash people with an interpretation of the First Amendment...it does not mean that Christians are second class citizens."

"I would like to see some public schools and public parks to stand up to them and not succumb to their bullying and intimidation. Because the FFRF has sent letters to 1,000 school districts, I'm offering them free admission for the teachers, students who come on an official public school trip."

Once again, there is a misleading headline. Nothing in the article suggests that the FFRF is afraid of Noah?s Ark.

It?s interesting that an organization dedicated to preserving the integrity of the First Amendment would be accused of ?bullying.? Ham likes to play the victim card.