Thread locking?

[Jezzebelle]

Now that plan, Augusto, sounds exactly what our Rule 5 is for. 

[Augusto]

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[Augusto]

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[Jezzebelle]

I did. Here http://isgodimaginary.com/forum/index.php/topic,61068.msg787386.html#msg787386

And mooby did.

[Gnu Ordure]

Right...!

That's untrutful, Gnu. That post was not taken out of context. Your interpretation of that quotation is untruthful.

It was obviously a joke, Augusto.

Your bias against Kiahanie is distorting your perception.

That doesn't have anything to do with the bullying I got because of my suggestion that Kiahanie should be removed from moderation.

On the other hand, people can see that in this thread alone you have made at least twenty posts attacking Kiahanie and his character, whereas he has kept a dignified silence.

So all the bullying is coming from you.

[Augusto]

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[Gnu Ordure]

Gnu: It was NOT a joke. It was his response to me questioning his behavior and reminding him that I had just congratulated him for his promotion.

And he made a joke about what would be required to bribe him.

Also don't confuse dignity with cowardice. These are two different things.

Oh look, you just insulted Kiahanie AGAIN by calling him a coward.

I am not bullying. He is not even here.

Your posts are consistently aggressive and insulting. How many E1 violations have you received so far?

I am arguying he should be removed from the charge and that doesn't constitute bullying.

It does if you keep repeating the request ad nauseam whilst making numerous snide remarks about Kiahanie needing to be in hospital, and other insulting bulls**t.

[Augusto]

I disagree with everything you're saying.

[Augusto]

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[Moderator 14]

Hi folks. What a s**tstorm. I've been picking huckleberries up at Odell Lake and just got back. It would have been good to post this earlier, but berry-picking in the mountains by a running stream is a good place for reflective thought.

I f**ked up. As I understand it I made two errors. The first error was splitting Kevin's fraccing thread so it would not get buried under a lot of garbage. The second error was locking the Boneyarded thread thinking Augusto was done with it.

The major cause for both errors was my failure to appreciate the essential role of collectivity in the moderation process. This is a bit surprising: I am not a cowboy, and in both my spiritual and political communities have high regard for the collective modes of decision-making. But I apparently got off the reservation on this one.

Another cause for my errors was a false belief that if I did this right I could avoid a trainwreck of a thread. A saying among Friends is "we always have the time to do something right; we never have time to do it wrong." (That's why it sometimes takes a long time to reach important decisions.) I tried to hurry what should have been handled through process. Among Friends, process is seen as at least as important as the result, and is often much more important. It looks as though what I was trying to do would not have worked anyway, so here we are with a mess and a lot of mod-work much of which I caused by doing it wrong. (This is a better place for this mess than Kevin's thread, so that's one good thing.)

Another cause for the errors was not understanding I am still wet behind the ears as a Mod. In most consensual settings there is room for individual initiative, but it is much better if the initiative is undertaken by an individual who knows what he is doing. I did not.

The environment in which the errors occurred is in the Mod Box, so I will reserve this part of the apology for discussion there if they so desire.

As rectification I will conform my activities as a mod to the principles covering other collective organizations to which I belong with special reference to especially to Quaker committees where all  policy matters are discussed and approved in committee.

The Mods are a great resource for letting me know when I am getting off track, and of course there are a few dozen Valued Members who won't have any difficulty letting me know, too., I will feel securely monitored. That's one of the great advantages of working in a collaborative environment.

I am signing off now, and don't plan on coming back to this thread unless to answer specific questions related to those errors. Kiahanie is waiting to use this screen (he has a lot of catch-up reading to do) so I'll leave it to him to defend himself.

[Case]

s**t happens. Don't sweat it.

[Mooby the Golden Sock]

@Augusto

I'm just really disappointed in all of this.

It takes a fair amount for me to intentionally drop an insult into a post, mainly because I don't want to create additional reports for the mods and because I see myself as having at least some responsibility in setting a positive example for the rest of the forum.  So believe me when I say that, while in the middle of a work day so busy that I went home 2 hours late, the only way I could think to express how I felt during my brief lunch break was an insult.  I now have a little more time to formulate my response, and edited my prior post accordingly. 

And I have spent an additional two hours typing this post rather than getting dinner or even getting changed out of my work clothes, despite my contacts sticking to my eyes and me wanting to get my (now brief) evening underway.  So believe me when I say I am serious here.

In this site's mission statement, we use lofty words like "supportive," "free and open," "inclusive," and "caring."  We don't always achieve these things, but we strive for them.  One of my goals as owner is to try to create a culture where members feel safe sharing things about themselves with a reasonable expectation that the community will be understanding and support them.  This can be a rarity on the Internet, as anyone who has ever dared to be a female online can tell you.

Kiahanie trusted the community enough to share some rather personal information with us, including experiences that are often stigmatized.  So have you.  So have many others, from stories of mental health issues to abuse to drug and alcohol history to whatever else.  And regardless of the varying viewpoints around here, I thought we all had a common human understanding that these things deserve a modicum of respect.  You have broken that trust.

How would you feel if, after you shared something sensitive here, someone followed you around and kept throwing it in your face, publicly and loudly and incessantly across multiple threads, making sure everyone was aware of it and viewed it in the worst light possible?  I know how I'd feel.  I'd regret ever saying anything, I'd feel betrayed and horrified and sick to my stomach.  I'd feel like the person doing it was--well, I already explained how I felt over lunch.  In short, I think it's despicable.

And stop with the BS about being concerned about alleged mental health issues.  When people have actual concerns about other members, they raise them in a way that gets a constructive result, they don't parade them out in public to embarrass that person.  The last time someone informed me of such a concern, they did so professionally and discreetly.  And this allowed the admins to handle it in such a way that I doubt the person in question was even aware that a concern was raised.  So pretty much the exact opposite of what you've been doing.

You've accused me of taking kiahanie's side.  Yes, that is absolutely what I am doing.  I stand behind each and every member of the IGI staff 100% of the time.  I publicly vouch for all of them, and will continue to do so as long as I am owner.  Even the ones that did not particularly care for me.  If I did not feel I could stand behind them, they would not be on staff.  So regardless of how many posts you make or how many times you tag me in a topic, I will never publicly denounce another member of the staff.  Plain and simple.

So if something gets screwed up, you can blame me personally for it.  I'll fix it, as I did here, and I'll personally apologize for it, as I did here.  Because it's my responsibility to make sure everyone is on the same page, and if something goes wrong it means that somewhere I've failed.  So you don't need to look at anyone else: the buck stops here.  If you feel the need to call for a resignation, call for mine.  If you start harassing the rest of my team, I'm going to tell you exactly what I think of you, and I won't hold back like I did today.

If you have a concern about how my team is run, you bring it up with me.  Or the Head Mod (Teaspoon Shallow), if you prefer.  Or one of the other admins if you feel you need to.  We'll take care of it.  That's our job.  You'll get a reply letting you know when it's been addressed.  Otherwise, when I reply to a thread saying something's been handled, it's been handled.  If you don't like it, then your gripe is with me.  If you go attacking the rest of my staff, I will gladly tell you where you can stick your complaints.

So I want you to know that I am not addressing a single one of your complaints about kiahanie.  They do not dignify a response.  I have not clicked on a single link you have posted.  I want to make it very, very clear that I will not be legitimizing any of your behavior.  Giving you a response would send a message that your atrocious behavior was somehow effective in getting you what you want--and I am not going to send that message. 

In fact, I am never going to respond to your complaint, even if you now raise it in private, because I want everyone reading this to know that I don't tolerate this bulls**t and will never give any credence to anyone who ever tries such a pathetic stunt.  You've lost your opportunity to raise this concern professionally with me, and you will not be getting it back.  You can still send me your concerns if you want, and I'll look into them (that is my job, after all), but you won't be getting any sort of response or follow-up and I'll never even acknowledge that you sent it, because you are not entitled to it and I'm no longer inclined to meet you halfway.

So go ahead and tag me in whatever post you want, it's not going to get you anywhere.  I stand behind my staff and that's final.

[none]

Heya Mooby, does that mean you are not going to tell me what evolutionary mechanism is responsible for Jesus' virgin birth?

[Augusto]

I understand.

We all are lucky to have you and I made mistakes, so I want to address them.

I did not understood the part of IGI in which you were trying to create an enviroment of trust, and that I did a horrible thing by betraying that trust. I never assumed anything on this forum to be sacred. Anytime I post anything about me I do so thinking that "it's all over the internet", and people have called me off for being a Venezuelan, for being poor, for the things I said I wrote and so on. To me, there wasn't anything sacred about Kiahanie's confession.

Yet, the fact that you see it that way helps me to understand why you reacted like that and what you're telling me all this. I now understand how seriously damaging my behavior was to the enviroment you are trying to sustain.

I did not know. If someone would have told me I would have stopped immediately. Now what I did cannot be undone. I am thinking right now about what to do and there's nothing I can think of, excepting offering a public apology and stating my compromise of not using personal information of anyone like I did here. I know it's not much, and I know I broke something, but I don't know what else to do.

I am glad I did not attacked anyone else, even when I felt I was entitled to, because I was under attack. I felt like I had the higher moral ground because I did not know all this members were addresing this somehow implicit compromise. I see now what Jezz, Kevin, Gnu and others were trying to do. Communication failed. Insults didn't allowed me to understand, I didn't receive a PM telling me that I was doing something wrong. To me it was about opening the eyes of fellow members and trying to solve my problems. Nobody offered as a mediator to convince Kiahanie during all this time either. I was fighting for my room alone.

I was ignorant, Mooby. I am sorry, I understand you cannot let me win this discussion. I wish you luck, I apologize, I will not try to question your choice or to insist in my arguments. I accept Kiahanie as a mod and will pay him the same respect I have given to all mods and admins when they are in duty.

I will also not mention again my personal problems with this Valued Member no matter what.

I am sorry I was a cause of distress to you. I am sorry you had this s**tty day because of me.

You are the best leader and your forum is the best. You grace us all with your good judgement and patience, at least to me you are a model and I try to learn from you how to be a better man.

I am currently editing all my post by my own initiative to remove all inflamatory material.

[kevin]

[80sChild]

Everyone calm down ok! Everyone has said things they wish that they can take back, I know I have . This arguing and bickering back and forth has been going on for hours, it's time to drop it. Kiahanie is a sweet wonderful man and though I'm sure he is happy for you having his back Mobby , I don't think he would want you losing it over something like this. Look at all of you ! You all are the ones that look mental right now ! We are a family here remember ? We're brothers and sisters , and yes we argue just like siblings do , but I am calling it ! Augusto , apologize to Kiahanie for making his state of mind the business of the World Wide Web and also apologize to Mobby , now Mobby apologize to Augusto for the language used towards him... Ok. I do not know if there are any others that should be apologizing if their are you know who you are and you should apologize as well, but my main cancer here is these two men . If we claim to be able to separate ourselves from the apes , act like it ! I am not trying to be bossy I just want to move on and get back to the happy dysfunctional family we are. Boys @Augusto @Mobby please ... ?? Good night !

[80sChild]

@Augusto thank you . It takes a bigger man to say I'm sorry than it does to say bad things. You did good.

[kevin]

im not sorry an i wont apologize

[80sChild]

im not sorry an i wont apologize

Ok Kevin .

[kevin]

what does emoji8 mean?

[80sChild]

what does emoji8 mean?

Lol it's a smiley , it's coming from my phone, I will get back on my laptop. It was a smiley blowing a kiss :)  nothing intended tho lol

[Augusto]

Lol, you got me off guard...!

Good night 80s...!

[80sChild]

Lol, you got me off guard...!

Good night 80s...!

I saw it, your good ! Good night!!  :)

[Augusto]

You're fast...!

[Gnu Ordure]

Apology to the IGI Community

I'm not sure you needed to apologize to us, Kia. Your two little errors didn't affect me negatively in any way, and they were reversible anyway. So I wasn't feeling any need for an apology myself. Maybe others feel differently. 

With regard to splitting the threads, you were just unlucky, in that you announced what you were going to do in advance; if one of the other Mods had read of your intentions, they would have stopped you. I'm not sure why I didn't confront you myself, because I know that it's not IGI policy to split threads - maybe because I think it should be IGI policy, and it made perfect sense in that instance!

Anyway, the important thing is we become wiser by learning from our mistakes, and if a similar situation occurs in the future, we will respond in a different manner. That's the best we can hope for in a world where everyone makes mistakes.

[Kiahanie]

[. . . .]
...the important thing is we become wiser by learning from our mistakes, and if a similar situation occurs in the future, we will respond in a different manner. That's the best we can hope for in a world where everyone makes mistakes.

Yup.

That was actually more in the nature of self-criticism, Gnu. I find that investigation helps me learn, adopt better practices, and when done publicly commits me to getting it right and in providing a basis for continued confidence and trust from my associates. It's a practice I try to incorporate into any secular organization I work with.

[Meat]

I'm ordering a cross and 4 railroad spikes for K. :D

[Kiahanie]

I'm ordering a cross and 4 railroad spikes for K. :D

Thanks, Meat.

If you order right now, I can have it by Halloween.

+1 when it arrives.

[Kiahanie]

@80sChild As long as the man has his ego well fed, he'll be just fine...!

my ego demands bribes at least consistent with my image of myself.  Not mere money: Fawning Adoration, public plaudits, garlands and wreaths laid before me!!

What's your professional opinion on Kiahanie's ego? @Gnu Ordure 

i can't believe he would say that! really?

80s, are you being sarcastic there? I can't tell...

If you were serious, let me inform you that in the above quote Kiahanie was joking.

He was employing irony, saying one thing but meaning the opposite.

No no no Gnu. I was really serious. Why would someone think I can be bribed by pixellated applause? And money? Pssshhh. I just went unscheduled huckleberry picking in the mountains for two afternoons. What would I need more money for? Of course, if I had enough money I could buy my prestige and fame, like The Donald bought his infamy and shame, but I'd do it better.

Hmmmm..... That sounds a lot like SteveO. I guess we do have some things in common.

[80sChild]

@Kiahanie I was joking too!! You will rarely find me being serious !