Why doesn't God seem ridiculous to everyone?

[Kusa]

I must say that even when I was a Christian I always knew that it sounded stupid. I always felt embarrassed to talk about Jesus or God.

Now that I have shed the religion thing I find it more preposterous than ever. I can't understand how people go day in and day out living a fantasy. When I hear people talk about their imaginary God it makes me shake my head. It is so ridiculous!

[Case]

Why's it ridiculous?

[Case]

Oops didn't realize what board I was in. Nevermind!

[Kusa]

Why's it ridiculous?

Because it's not real.

[kevin]

of course it's not real. but theism is an easy substitute for critical thought, and so it holds an attraction for people who are either intellectually lazy or don't have the reasoning skills to see through the attractive skin to the hollowness inside.

sometimes people have an epiphany, and reject the nonsense they were taught in favor of a rational view of the world. when this happens it usually provides an immediate emotional lift, because the effort of maintaining the cognitive dissonance is no longer a burden.

[Kusa]

Cognative dissonance. I used to have a lot of that.

[Boots]

Because of how people are raised, in general.  Their own god is reasonable and right, but all those others are ridiculous.

[Kusa]

Because of how people are raised, in general.  Their own god is reasonable and right, but all those others are ridiculous.

I was raised a Christian and I thought any notion of God was silly. I must admit that the other gods were more silly at the time.

[jetson]

I have always thought that all gods were mythological. I had no reason to think otherwise, other than the fact that I was standing in Catholic churches with adults around me chanting phrases and kneeling and standing, etc. I though all of it was weird. Always had a feeling people were too afraid to challenge. Now I know that was fairly accurate.

In my opinion, fear is the main driver for god beliefs.

[kevin]

that follows from simple observation. you'll notice that the dominant christian systems are guilt-based, operating on threats of damnation to ensure that the logical disconnects are swept under the carpet. but other systems such as islam or hinduism also hold a threat over the heads of non-believers, in one case a hell similar to that of christianity, and in the other an inhospitable future of continued transmigration.

fear is the obvious motivator. the christian concepts of love and faith are clearly spurious attempts to rationalize a system which has baser motivations at its core.

[Happy Evolute]

... see through the attractive skin to the hollowness inside.

The inverse of the Emperor's lack of clothes.

In this case there are the clothes but no Emperor, and people like the clothes, they are nicely done.

Not at all ridiculous, more art, less science.

[ak.yonathan]

I guess because different people have different ways of thinking. Maybe some people think that the idea of an omnipotent being isn't so ridiculous as you think.

[Happy Evolute]

I guess because different people have different ways of thinking. Maybe some people think that the idea of an omnipotent being isn't so ridiculous as you think.

If you reflect upon the meaning of the word "omnipotent" you will come to realise that the idea of "omnipotence" is ridiculous.

Try it, and see.

[8livesleft]

of course it's not real. but theism is an easy substitute for critical thought, and so it holds an attraction for people who are either intellectually lazy or don't have the reasoning skills to see through the attractive skin to the hollowness inside.

sometimes people have an epiphany, and reject the nonsense they were taught in favor of a rational view of the world. when this happens it usually provides an immediate emotional lift, because the effort of maintaining the cognitive dissonance is no longer a burden.

This is one reason.

The main reason is reinforcement.

Thing is we're born into these belief systems. For Catholics, we're baptised a few months after birth, start attending mass before we can speak, attend various events of a religious nature throughout the year, all for the rest of our lives or at least until we start questioning.

That's a hell of a lot of reinforcement.

For most, it becomes so ingrained that even to question is near impossible. For them, of course there's a god.

So having that at your core, no matter what science can prove or disprove, you will attach that belief to any sliver of uncertainty. And the universe is still so big and unknown that it's unlikely the god belief would disappear altogether.

It all depends on your religious support system. If you regularly reinforce your belief via mass, daily prayers, then you will likely never stop believing. But if your system is weak, you don't pray, don't go to mass, then it becomes easier to accept other lines of thought.

[kevin]

all if that is food for thought, but since the whole idea of the existence of gods is absurd, it really requires an accommodation with paradox to maintain the activity.

most of the early desert fathers were hermits, isolated from one another and from any common human contact. in there case, the christian delusion was kept going by occasional meetings with other hermits. the common asceticism was a strong bond reinforcing the imagination even in the absence of human contact or religious activities.

[ak.yonathan]

I guess because different people have different ways of thinking. Maybe some people think that the idea of an omnipotent being isn't so ridiculous as you think.

If you reflect upon the meaning of the word "omnipotent" you will come to realise that the idea of "omnipotence" is ridiculous.

Try it, and see.

I have and you're right it is a logical impossibility.

[8livesleft]

all if that is food for thought, but since the whole idea of the existence of gods is absurd, it really requires an accommodation with paradox to maintain the activity.

Yes. That's why the followers absolutely need as much reinforcement as possible via daily/weekly prayer rituals.

Would you need a daily reminder if gods did in fact exist? No. You need a daily reminder precisely because they don't.

[kevin]

on the other hand, the utility of places like igi or wwgha are that the oppositecan occur. nonbelievers who are doubting their own assurance have somewhere to go to ask questions stions or see arguments that puzsle them refuted.

[Kiahanie]

I rather think Kevin and I (and Shawna, and very likely any other theists who have experiences with what they they consider god) are experiencing something similar and describing it in terms of dissimilar life experiences and contexts.

OTOH, since I am not an atheist for rational or logical reasons, those who believe in a god for logical or rational reasons lose me completely. I don't see the point.

I think my major issue in dealing with spiritual experience "logically" (either pro- or con-) is the reductionism inherent in any "logical" approach.

[8livesleft]

I will say this tho, if the education system is weak in terms of teaching morality, then religion certainly helps in at least giving some sort of moral compass.

There's an inherent danger in raising kids with zero sense of morality. Senseless mass killings is the worst thing that can happen. 
Of course parenting is the major issue there (hence my parenting thread) but assuming the parents are incapable, the next best thing would be the religious moral system - the school can teach it or it's discussed on church days.

[Kiahanie]

I would be very leery of a morality based on "thou shalt" and "thou shalt not," which was my own experience as a child. I think a broad and thorough interpretation of "Citizenship" in schools would go a long way to establishing the basis for a personal morality.

Unfortunately, my experience (and that of our son) is that "citizenship" as taught in schools is mostly chauvinist cheer-leading.

[8livesleft]

I would be very leery of a morality based on "thou shalt" and "thou shalt not," which was my own experience as a child. I think a broad and thorough interpretation of "Citizenship" in schools would go a long way to establishing the basis for a personal morality.

Unfortunately, my experience (and that of our son) is that "citizenship" as taught in schools is mostly chauvinist cheer-leading.

Care to expound on "citizenship?"

[Kiahanie]

My experience (50-60 years ago) and that of our son ( 13-19 ybp) with Citizenship modules and courses is that they teach federal and state constitutions, inflated notions of how democratic we are and how well we fulfill the promises in the Declaration of Independence and Constitutions, and patriotic often militaristic histories.

My notion of citizenship involves responsibility for oneself and mutual responsibility for/with all others. As well as other stuff.

[8livesleft]

My notion of citizenship involves responsibility for oneself and mutual responsibility for/with all others. As well as other stuff.

Hmm...a sense of responsibility does seem to be a good way and that's actually how we're trying to raise our 5 year old daughter.

We're trying to instill in her the reality that her actions can and will affect others so she always has to include those around her in her thought process.

It seems more practical as opposed to telling her to follow rules set by some powerful angry being that she will likely never ever see, and then tell her that all she has to do is repent and all is forgiven because that same powerful and angry being is also extremely merciful and forgiving....huh? Lol

But like I said this duality seems to work in a lot of people.

[Shawna]

Keep in mind when you are discussing belief in God that some people start out not believing, and then move to believing.  Belief in God is not a one way street where one starts out within a family of believers and then learns to reject belief in God.  It's not really even a two-way street, I think.  People's beliefs are more fluid than that.

The short answer is that God doesn't seem ridiculous to everyone, because, for some people, the concept of God fits their world-view and makes sense.

[RegalSin]

*E2g - Moderator 11*[/quote]